Rules Question: Incorrect drop

[Kobey]

Well, there is no penalty for hitting a provisional when it is not permitted. It simply becomes the ball in play. So, even if you KNOW your ball is out of bounds and you announce you're hitting a provisional, there is no consequence, as long as you continue to play the new ball.

Yeah, i don't think they worded and explained it the best in the rules.

 

[blugold]

Yeah, i don't think they worded and explained it the best in the rules.

I honestly think the announcement is to declare intent. So you can't just hit a second ball for the practice.

 

[TheWoo]

But if your ball is in the hazard, you can take the drop and not have to go all the way back to the tee or where you played your last shot from.

Right, but sometimes it's the best option. We have a par 3 at my course where there's nothing between the tee and the green. If I think I may not have carried the hazard, I'd love the option to hit a provisional, so I can keep the option of playing from the hazard if it's found and playable in the hazard. That's not allowed under the rules.

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[wadesworld]

But if your ball is in the hazard, you can take the drop and not have to go all the way back to the tee or where you played your last shot from.

Correct, but there may be rare situations where that is not your best option.

Consider the case where there's tall grass directly in front of the tee, then a water hazard. You hit your ball into the hazard on the far side, but you're not sure if it bounced out. So you hit a provisional.

After going forward, you determine your ball is within the hazard. You cannot play the provisional, and you cannot drop in front of the hazard. You also don't want to drop behind the hazard because of the grass, so you decide to play from the original spot.

Like I said, a very rare occurrence.

 

[wadesworld]

Right, but sometimes it's the best option. We have a par 3 at my course where there's nothing between the tee and the green. If I think I may not have carried the hazard, I'd love the option to hit a provisional, so I can keep the option of playing from the hazard if it's found and playable in the hazard. That's not allowed under the rules.

Whoa, one sec.

If you think you have not carried the hazard, then you have the option to play a provisional, since you do not KNOW your ball is in the hazard.

If you then find your ball in the hazard and wish to play it from within the hazard, you can do so. You simply pick up the provisional.

If the argument is you'd like to play a provisional for a ball you KNOW to be in the hazard in case you find it not playable from the hazard, and then select the option of stroke and distance, then I'd agree, that would be convenient. However, it's not how it works today as far as I know.

 

[TheWoo]

Whoa, one sec.

If you think you have not carried the hazard, then you have the option to play a provisional, since you do not KNOW your ball is in the hazard.

If you then find your ball in the hazard and wish to play it from within the hazard, you can do so. You simply pick up the provisional.

If the argument is you'd like to play a provisional for a ball you KNOW to be in the hazard in case you find it not playable from the hazard, and then select the option of stroke and distance, then I'd agree, that would be convenient. However, it's not how it works today as far as I know.

Yes, you've got what I was saying. Plus, if I find the ball in the hazard I have to pick up the provisional regardless of whether I want to play it or not. I'd simply like playing the provisional to still be an option even when the ball is found for pace of play and ease purposes.

We're on the same page with how it actually works...

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[Fourputt]

Now I'm confused. Why would you have to return to the tee if your ball is in the hazard?

My home course has a par 5 where the normal play is to the fairway right of a long narrow lake with an irrigation ditch running parallel to the lake. The end of the lake is about 230 yards from the back tees, but there are trees on the far end, making the carry much longer to clear the lake and trees. Even clearing the trees you can find heavy rough on the left side (the trees are inside of the hazard margin, but much of the rough is not). It's fairly common for someone either intentionally trying to cross the hazard, or accidentally hooking one there, to hit the trees on the far end. Unless someone sees the ball splash down afterward, there is no certainty that the ball is in the hazard, but it can still be easily lost. Thus in that case a provisional ball is the accepted practice. If the original ball is then found in the big rocks along the bank, there may be no option but stroke and distance, since the ball most likely crossed the hazard margin about 10 feet in front of the tee. That means a walk back to the tee. If the original ball is not found, then the provisional ball is the ball in play.

My men's club invokes the local rule allowing a provisional ball for the water hazard on this hole in the interest of pace of play, but it's important before you declare it that your only options are to play the ball as it lies in the hazard or stroke and distance, because that local rule discards the option for dropping 2 clublengths from the hazard margin. If the ball lies unplayable in the hazard, you are required to continue play with the provisional ball.

 

[Kobey]

My men's club invokes the local rule allowing a provisional ball for the water hazard on this hole in the interest of pace of play, but it's important before you declare it that your only options are to play the ball as it lies in the hazard or stroke and distance, because that local rule discards the option for dropping 2 clublengths from the hazard margin. If the ball lies unplayable in the hazard, you are required to continue play with the provisional ball.

I thought they weren't allowed to make local rules that changed the USGA rules like that?

 

[Fourputt]

I thought they weren't allowed to make local rules that changed the USGA rules like that?

Look in the appendix of the Rules of Golf. That is an authorized local rule.

1. Water Hazards; Ball Played Provisionally Under Rule 26-1

If a water hazard (including a lateral water hazard) is of such size and shape and/or located in such a position that:
(i) it would be impracticable to determine whether the ball is in the hazard or to do so would unduly delay play, and
(ii) if the original ball is not found, it is known or virtually certain that it is in the water hazard,
the Committee may introduce a Local Rule permitting the play of a ball provisionally under Rule 26-1. The ball is played provisionally under any of the applicable options under Rule 26-1 or any applicable Local Rule. In such a case, if a ball is played provisionally and the original ball is in a water hazard, the player may play the original ball as it lies or continue with the ball played provisionally, but he may not proceed under Rule 26-1 with regard to the original ball.
In these circumstances, the following Local Rule is recommended:
“If there is doubt whether a ball is in or is lost in the water hazard (specify location), the player may play another ball provisionally under any of the applicable options in Rule 26-1.
If the original ball is found outside the water hazard, the player must continue play with it.
If the original ball is found in the water hazard, the player may either play the original ball as it lies or continue with the ball played provisionally under Rule 26-1.
If the original ball is not found or identified within the five-minute search period, the player must continue with the ball played provisionally.
PENALTY FOR BREACH OF LOCAL RULE:

Match play – Loss of hole; Stroke play – Two strokes.”

In our case, there is a strip of land which is still in the hazard between the irrigation ditch and the lake where balls often land. It is sometimes impossible to tell if the ball stayed up or rolled down into the hazard until you get there. Since the ball will usually have crossed into the hazard right in front of the tee, the 2 clublength drop is rarely an option, so that means walking or driving back to the tee if you don't find the ball in a playable position. Having the local rule in play allows a provisional ball to save time. If you don't find the original ball playable either in or out of the hazard, the provisional ball becomes the ball in play (unless by some very unlikely circumstance the original ball is found unplayable outside of the hazard - then you proceed under Rule 28).

 

[TheWoo]

I'd like this local rule to be made a regular rule by the USGA. Excellent decision.

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