RH Draw vs LH Fade, ball flight
A right handed draw is not going to have as much spin as a left handed fade and should go father with more roll out.
I'm a little out of practice but as a lefty, my fades are high flying and have higher spin than my draws. I would assume the same applies to a RH draw that they would have a lower ball flight and spin than my fades with certain things being equal in the swings like speed and attack angle.
- Thread starter
- #4
I had always thought of a fade as having "back spin" and therefore higher and shorter. And a draw as having "top spin" and therefore "roll out". However I think that may be too simplistic.
If the face angle was the same number, (created by the same club path and face to path numbers and assume same angle of attack and dynamic loft), would you not get the same spin axis?
I imagine there is a bias - when a rightie hits with an inside-out swing path you will get different angle of attack *generally*, than when a leftie hits an outside-in swing path *generally*, but I imagine it is possible to get the same numbers, so if you did would the ball flight be the same?
This sort of comes from a weird thought - can you back spin a draw (on a high wedge for example)?
If the face angle was the same number, (created by the same club path and face to path numbers and assume same angle of attack and dynamic loft), would you not get the same spin axis?
I imagine there is a bias - when a rightie hits with an inside-out swing path you will get different angle of attack *generally*, than when a leftie hits an outside-in swing path *generally*, but I imagine it is possible to get the same numbers, so if you did would the ball flight be the same?
This sort of comes from a weird thought - can you back spin a draw (on a high wedge for example)?
alvinsmalvin
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 11, 2022
- Messages
- 393
- Reaction score
- 309
There most likely would be differences, but depends on the ball, club and golfer. Every time.
- Thread starter
- #6
Maybe I need to rephrase the question. Assuming the the trackman numbers were the same (or close to), would you expect the same ball flight?
As I say that, I guess the answer is yes?
I understand that getting the same numbers with a RH draw vs LH Fade might be very difficult, but essentially a ball hit with same swing speed and attack angle / dynamic loft by a leftie with fade or a rightie with draw should do the same thing and go the same distance.
[and note: before when I said "top spin" - I was wrong, it is more an impression. I realise that golf ball never really topspins (unless it is driven by me on the 1st tee with a big crowd - commonly called "a top" directly into the ground)]
I don't think a ball will fly with "top spin". I think fades have MORE back spin.
na, you got it backwards; a fade is gonna land softer and not roll so much!
If you take the right hand-left hand out you can put the face angle the same on the same path, but they'd only be near the same result on a straight path, straight shot. If you're flight is curving the same amount left for both, the RH player on a straight path would have essentially delivered with a closed face and less dynamic loft, creating less spin. For the LH player to create a similar flight from a straight/neutral path they would be delivering with an open face and more loft, creating more spin. The lefty could try to lean on it and deliver a lot less loft to mimic the flight, but you'd just never realistically get the exact same numbers. You're closing the face from opposite directions to a curved shot.
- Thread starter
- #9
I don't doubt it would be hard for two players, one RH and the other LH to mimic each other, but that is not the point. Everything you are saying makes sense and I understand what you mean, but what I've been pondering is "what if" the numbers were the same.
Hypothetically let's get a RH to hit 1000 high draws on trackman. Let's then get a LH to hit 1000 fades. (Or maybe bring Iron Byron (and a LH clone) out of retirement and set them up with draw/fade swing paths). The paths would be the appropriate path for each respective shot, not just face change on a straight path. Then find the hits where the numbers matched (remember it's hypothetical), so the RH face is closed to path to the same angle the LH is open to path (i.e.: same face angle), and same dynamic loft (the question is not how to achieve this, just what happens when they do).
I had also wondered whether the club face shape would make a difference (being in reverse of each other). However the contact point is so small and so quick, I figure that any impact would be negligible.
the slice is more of a swipe because the club face is open to path. the path is going away from the angle of the face.
if you start with same degree drivers, the lh slice would be higher lofted at impact.
Now if you started with, say 4° lower lofted lh driver or whatever it would take to even the lofts out, you MIGHT get equal numbers, but I don't think so just because of dynamics.
if you start with same degree drivers, the lh slice would be higher lofted at impact.
Now if you started with, say 4° lower lofted lh driver or whatever it would take to even the lofts out, you MIGHT get equal numbers, but I don't think so just because of dynamics.
a RH golfer that launches a ball at 15° with 2300rpm of backspin and 230rpm of right to left spin will have the same ballflight as a LH golfer that launches a ball at 15° with 2300rpm of backspin and 230rpm of right to left spin
that was the question, right?
that was the question, right?
- Thread starter
- #12
If you think about draw the path is also going away from the angle of the face.
I am thinking more iron than driver - but it is irrelevant as I am assuming the same dynamic loft at impact.
- Thread starter
- #13
I think that is sort of the question, yeah. I am saying the same numbers all around, club head speed, dynamic loft, same path angle and same face angle. As I say that, I feel like it answers the question - of course it will have the same flight (but I am not sure, so that's why I asked
).If you think that Trackman, etc are built on algorithms with inputs, then if the inputs are the same - the result should be. Am I missing something about the face shape when presented on a LH club vs a RH club, or something (I think same dynamic loft and face angle cover that??)?
Maybe the attached pic will help. The question is would it make any difference if a LH club produced the same numbers.
Another related question would be, is an 8 iron hit with the same club head speed, attack angle, and dynamic loft going to be similar in length to a 2 iron with the same? I guess Kyle Berkshire answers that one... (only need the first 10 seconds).
[Note your post confused me slightly because I had not thought of a ball as having *both* backspin and right-to-left spin rate, rather a single spin rpm and an axis angle. I think you are saying the same thing though]
Last edited: