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Squaring the club head...

ShotScope
You have to drive the hips and shoulders through the ball. Until this happens regularly for you, you will have to make sure that your hands release the toe of the club. To feel the hands release take some baseball swings and feel the natural release of the hands. Keep working this drill. The misses you listed above were more an issue of the club face being open. I know this is a tuff move but you will get there.
 
amollerud said:
You have to drive the hips and shoulders through the ball. Until this happens regularly for you, you will have to make sure that your hands release the toe of the club. To feel the hands release take some baseball swings and feel the natural release of the hands. Keep working this drill. The misses you listed above were more an issue of the club face being open. I know this is a tuff move but you will get there.
Click to expand...

Since I moved, I had to find a new instructor and met with a guy yesterday who showed a fair bit of promise. When he introduced himself he talked about his game progression and his major swing faults/struggles which happen to very much mirror mine. We got rained out before we could do much more than hit 4-5 balls on the range but he talked about the same things that you did. That I maintain reasonable position until my hands are at my waist, but I don't have any "drive" with my shoulder/hips through the ball. The last 3 feet of clubhead distance is all arms and my body just follows the arms around causing erratic shots, and high launch angles.

He gave me a couple drills to work on, but mostly just swinging 2 clubs with my left hand to force me to swing with my hips and shoulders. I am meeting with him again tomorrow for some range work and again next week.

Once he showed me the hip position he wants me in at contact I took a couple swings and hit some of the best irons I have in a long time. Afterwards he commented that I still wasn't anywhere close to where I should be, and that those iron shots were just a taste of what it will feel/look like to actually strike a ball well! I can't wait for that feeling!

He also told me that since I have a developed swing that this change is going to take a really long time, and that I will play very inconsistant with my longer clubs until I get used to it. My shorter irons will improve very quickly and I should start hitting more GIR soon, but the driver and hybrids wont come around for a couple months.

Thanks for all your help. I would post videos but I think i'll wait till the outing and you can (hopefully) see the progress in person!

Gus
 
Andy,
I thought I would show you some of my progress as I work through Golftec lessons this winter. I am still a little underplane on my take away- but overall I can see some major improvements in swing mechanics from the first to the last. If you have any thoughts, let me know!

Here is the video from the START of my first lesson.


Here is the video from my second lesson


Here is the video from the end of my most recent lesson. I think the difference is night and day... and we haven't even started working on the downswing yet. Just take away and trying really hard to limit my shoulder turn at the top. This lesson was the first time since I started practicing that I felt like I was making good contact with the ball.
 
GUS I LOVE IT!!!! You takeaway and top are looking VERY good! There is something that I saw in the last video that is awesome...watch the video from the front view. Watch your right elbow from the top down. See how it is working into your side and that you hands are now getting deeper in the swing (meaning they are getting too the ball and slightly in front). This is a great example of knowing what to work on and how to make the change. What a great job you have done and all the hard work is paying off.
 
Andy- I am going to copy and paste a post I made elsewhere here. I would be interested to hear your thoughts. My swing plane looks good and we are working on opening some space from my right elbow and my body so I can "drop" the club into the slot. The swing actually looks really good to my untrained eye. On the vector EVERYTHING was a fade if I am being a generous and a slice if I am being honest

There is a pervasive saying around here. "The numbers don't lie".
If that's the case, I am in a LOT of trouble.

This winter I decided (for lots of reasons) to buy a large pack of Golftec lessons and really hammer out my swing. I had gotten myself down to a 14 handicap by the end of the season, but I was very inconsistent and owed my low handicap to shooting lights out 1/4 rounds and then sucking 3/4 rounds. I want to be better. More consistently.

I started in December and have been working very hard on the drills and swing my coach and I are building. I am very happy and very impressed with the results. When I watch a video of my swing side by side with a pro I see more in common than I see different. It's a great feeling.

The problem with my time a golftec is that I am looking ONLY at my swing in terms of positions, angles, and swing plane... and not ball flight. This is an issue because come saturday morning I'll be swinging my clubs on a course. For a score. In front of other people. I will be standing on the tee on hole #1 and I will have not a single clue where the ball might be going.

Tonight I went to golftec and worked with my coach, made another big step in my swing... and then I asked if he had any clue what my ball flight would be like. He set up the vector for me so I could see a top down view of my ball flight and off I went. I hit 6i first (since all of my work has been with irons). I was swinging in the 82-84 mph range and getting carries of 165-180 depending on my contact. I had a lot of mishits in there, but we wont talk about those. I also saw a pretty consistent 15-30 yard fade. Uh Oh.

Then I switched to driver... first drive I didn't see my swing speed. 250 Carry (about what I normally play) and 30 yards slice. Playable. Then the machine started misbehaving and not registering my swings. I call the guy in to fix it and I never hit another ball over 210. My swing speed never broke 98. I never hit anything with less than 70 yards of slice.

At the outing my ss was in the 105-108 range (110 w/ the cleveland ultra lite). My bridgestone ball fitting my ss was 108. My ss at golftec was 92-94 and I was getting 180-200 yards of carry. I call the guy back in and say that I think it is registering wrong, since I KNOW my swingspeed/carry but even after a recalibration I get the same results.

I feel like an internet golfer- telling him my swingspeed is 105 when the vector clearly says 92. Telling him my carry is usually 240-250 when the vector clearly says 200-210. That doesnt include my 17-20* launch angle, 2000 side spin, and 130 mph ball speed.

Obviously I have some MAJOR problems even though my swing LOOKS good. This weekend has the potential to be ugly ugly golf for me. I guess my question is this: Could the vector be wrong, or am I an internet golfer?
Click to expand...
 
I'll throw up my most recent video as well...

 
Gus I just finished reading your previous post about ss and ball flight. I need to mention a few things...numbers don't lie. BUT for the numbers to mean anything the vector has to be set up proper and parallel to your target line. I know that I see in the store here (not in our center!!!) the launch monitors are all over the place. I hit some drivers yesterday and it said I was hitting a 20 yard push with about 30 yards of cut on it. To test the machine I hit a going hook that hit the side net before the back net and it said I hit it dead straight.

For the record I think all should know this. On launch monitors the machine measures the ball and ESTIMATES club head speed. Next time you are in GolfTEC look at the reading from the TEK mat you are hitting off of. Our mats measure the club head. This will be a much better measure of ss.

If it makes you feel any better I hit nothing but cuts on the vector, and outside I am fitting a hook.

By the way I am loving the progress in your swing. I would imagine you are starting to hit the ball pretty solid. I see less over the top and you are getting into much better positions though out the swing. Great work.
 
amollerud said:
Gus I just finished reading your previous post about ss and ball flight. I need to mention a few things...numbers don't lie. BUT for the numbers to mean anything the vector has to be set up proper and parallel to your target line. I know that I see in the store here (not in our center!!!) the launch monitors are all over the place. I hit some drivers yesterday and it said I was hitting a 20 yard push with about 30 yards of cut on it. To test the machine I hit a going hook that hit the side net before the back net and it said I hit it dead straight.

For the record I think all should know this. On launch monitors the machine measures the ball and ESTIMATES club head speed. Next time you are in GolfTEC look at the reading from the TEK mat you are hitting off of. Our mats measure the club head. This will be a much better measure of ss.

If it makes you feel any better I hit nothing but cuts on the vector, and outside I am fitting a hook.

By the way I am loving the progress in your swing. I would imagine you are starting to hit the ball pretty solid. I see less over the top and you are getting into much better positions though out the swing. Great work.
Click to expand...

Thanks for your thoughts Andy!

The range showed me about what I expected distance wise, with my best balls being straight with a cut on the end... and the worst being big bananas. I can't tell what the difference is between the two swings though. I won't get frusterated this weekend... just play a hard fade and make the most of it.

Thanks for the continued help!
 
Andy,

I have had a lot of success with Golftec recently and wanted to post my newest video and get your thoughts. Please ignore the weird coloring, as my video conversion software leaves a little to be desired.

7iron, 3/23
 
Gus my internet at work blocks this site. Iwill take a look when I get home tonight.
 
Not a problem. I can put it up YouTube style (and the color will look normal)- it just wont be able to be "slowed down"

 
RxGus the changes are amazing. The swing looks so solid. I have to imagine that you are hitting the ball much more solid right now. I am truley impressed with the work you have put in. Great job and thanks for the hard work you have put in to this point!
 
Hey Andy,

I have been working pretty hard on my iron swing and it is starting to show. Consistency is still a bit of an issue, but all around I am getting pretty good "on course" results.
My huge struggle now is that I can't seem to keep my driver anywhere near the course that I am playing. I worked with my golftec coach on it a bit and he gave me a few drills, which I have been accomplishing in some manner the past couple of times I have been to the driving range.

For whatever reason I can't seem to get my driver under the swing plane. While it isn't an over the top move, I just seem to continue to get an outside-in club path. He told me to move the ball way in front of my left foot and to take 1/2 swings, making sure to shut my wrist and force a right to left ball flight. When do this on the range I feel like I am under plane and snapping my wrist shut and I still don't get very drastic movement R to L. As I work my way back to full swings eventually I get back to the 50-60 yard, unplayable slice.

Some questions for you.
1. Why is the driver so hard for me to get under plane, when the iron swing has become pretty natural to me? Is it just the club length?
2. Is there a way, based on ball flight, to tell if a slice is being caused by an open club at impact or by a poor swing plane (outside-in)?
3. Currently my SuperTri is set the NU and the weight is in the heel. In putters they talk about having weight in the toe helps to square the clubface (on an arc) and prevent leaving it open at impact. Is that same principle true for other clubs? Would I be better served moving the heavy weight back to the middle?
4. What are your thoughts on the Medicus Vision track? I was thinking about getting one to help visualize my driver plane better. Are they worth the $50?
 
Gus great questions:

1. The length and weight make it hard to get under the plane. It is the longest/lightest club in the bag. You need to really try to over do the drills and feel that club working inside out and away from you.
2. With ball flight, if the ball starts right of your line and then moves right as it looses speed that is open club face. If it is starting at your target or left of it and moves right you are coming outside in.
3. I would go to a neutral versus NU. With the long clubs weight in the heel slows the heel and allows the toe to catch up and is opposite of putters.
4. You will get the same benefit out of a 3 tee reroute drill and save yourself the $50.
 
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