when bunker sand is not consistant

rollin · Oct 1, 2012

wadesworld said:
I play on a course that has this same type of sand. In 99% of the cases, if you're trying to play a traditional blast shot, you're screwed. You'll go right under it and won't get it out. You have to play much more like a chip/pitch.

And yes, courses should certainly make an effort to make sure the sand type is consistent throughout the course.

yea but chip/pitch is not easy espec if on a slope but is what it is. And practicing bunkers not always helpful cause those practice conditions could way differ from what ya may catch while playing. I guess best way to get better is to hit into um more often. lol

thedue · Oct 1, 2012

rollin said:
I never experienced a course with no bunkers. What do they have to protect greens and swallow mishits? do the have heavy ruf or something in those areas instead?

They have a variety of things, usually some kind of water (creek or pond right up to an edge, mounded grass bunkers, and heavy rough that zig zags down the course. A few holes on my home course actually have a tree or two in the fw or overhanging part of the green to make you move the ball one way or another on approach.

rollin · Oct 1, 2012

thedue said:
They have a variety of things, usually some kind of water (creek or pond right up to an edge, mounded grass bunkers, and heavy rough that zig zags down the course. A few holes on my home course actually have a tree or two in the fw or overhanging part of the green to make you move the ball one way or another on approach.

I guess some of that stuff sounds like could be more troublesome than bunkers.

thedue · Oct 1, 2012

rollin said:
I guess some of that stuff sounds like could be more troublesome than bunkers.

At times the grass bunkers are almost impossible to get out of. I'd like to have the sand, but its expensive to build bunkers correctly and worst to maintain for these smaller city courses and clubs.

JF · Oct 1, 2012

I'm not that bad out of bunkers if they're all the same. But off hard sand one day then soft the next, I can't do it...

rollin · Oct 1, 2012

JF16 said:
I'm not that bad out of bunkers if they're all the same. But off hard sand one day then soft the next, I can't do it...

never mind day to day, but much worse when it varry's hole to hole on same round if ya end up in a few

Canadan · Oct 1, 2012

There are only two things that bother me about sand traps..

1 - Bunkers that are not well combed and find the ball in front of a big clump of sand.
2 - Bunkers that are extremely shallow. Nothing like digging deep in a bunker only to find dirt/clay on your wedge hahahaha!

TheHeez · Oct 1, 2012

Canadan said:
There are only two things that bother me about sand traps..

1 - Bunkers that are not well combed and find the ball in front of a big clump of sand.
2 - Bunkers that are extremely shallow. Nothing like digging deep in a bunker only to find dirt/clay on your wedge hahahaha!

Amen! I had this recently, the top layer was very soft and I took a full cut expecting a big splash out. Darn near hurt my wrist when I plowed into rock hard dirt. Getting your feet into that sands helps to determine what you are dealing with but the unexpected sure can mess it all up. :angry:

wadesworld · Oct 1, 2012

TheHeez said:
Amen! I had this recently, the top layer was very soft and I took a full cut expecting a big splash out. Darn near hurt my wrist when I plowed into rock hard dirt. Getting your feet into that sands helps to determine what you are dealing with but the unexpected sure can mess it all up.

Yeah, I had one of these recently too. I was trying to play a "wide-open-face-fly-it-all-the-way-to-the-hole" shot, but there was some sort of harder sand below the soft sand. My club bounced right off the harder stuff and thinned the ball. As long as I played a traditional blast, I could get it out, but trying to play the fancy shot failed every time.

Lefty78 · Oct 1, 2012

Consistency certainly is to be desired. Maintenance of bunkers is key to them being in playable condition and maintenance is labor cost. When superintendents are deciding on where to "spend" the labor bunkers are generally the near the bottom priority somewhere after greens, fairways, and even tees.

Proper construction is essential to having greens which can be maintained and proper construction also is very expensive. Every green should be built with good drainage and a good liner. The liner is essential to keep the native soil, gravel and dirt from migrating to the top of the sand and...you guessed it...good liner material is very expensive as well.

The actual type of sand is pretty important but not as much as the other factors I have mentioned here. The last time we refurbished our bunkers a few years ago, we spent lots more time deciding on the type sand and drainage than upon the type of liner. Now we have very inconsistent bunkers mostly because of using cheaper liner and in some cases no liner. The sand turned out to be a poor choice too, it was the same that Eastlake used that same year, they replaced all their sand within a year and, of course, we couldn't do that. Even with all that, our bunkers are pretty decent when they are maintained. We did institute the recommended local rule about declaring stones in the bunker as movable obstructions.

I am on the "bunker committee" now and we are looking at redoing bunkers to original specs with the best liner and two different sands. But whatever we do, my recommendation will be to rake and groom the bunkers 3-4 times per week.

The only good thing from having this degree of inconsistency, when I play at another course their bunkers are usually pretty easy because I've seen whatever they have at my home course.

Mr. Satchmo · Oct 1, 2012

Canadan said:
There are only two things that bother me about sand traps..

1 - Bunkers that are not well combed and find the ball in front of a big clump of sand.
2 - Bunkers that are extremely shallow. Nothing like digging deep in a bunker only to find dirt/clay on your wedge hahahaha!

Dude what bothers me in sand bunkers is when the sand is freaken rocky, here they dig into the ground, rake the big rocks out but most of the time there are still lots of tiny rocks that chew up my wedges

HoselRocket104 · Oct 1, 2012

http://www.golfwolfcreek.com/layout9.asp?id=863&page=48676&sid=1896

Last March i was playing Wolf Creek in Mesquite NV. It's a pretty amazing golf course. Anyway we get to #4 and i'm only +1. See the layout of hole#4 on the link about. I hit my drive into one of the bunkers. When i stepped in i sunk about 6 inches. Never seen bunkers like this. I swung and hit it fat. The sand was so heavy. I ended up hitting six shots out of the sand. Each time was a herculian effort but it never went anywhere. I came out of the sand finally and was drenched with sweat and breathing hard. It was crazy. The rest of the day i was so scared of the bunkers. I thought they were all like that.

We got done and were having a beer in the clubhouse. The bartender asked what we thought and i brought up the bunkers on #4. He started laughing. They were repairing all the bunkers and had just finished laoding fresh sand into all of them. The water them constantly at night to get them ready. We were supposed to play them ground under repair but the started forgot to mention that and they didn't have signs. It didn't ruin my round because Wolf Creek is amazing. It did change my game though. I was a workout just to get out of the bunkers.

Canadan · Oct 1, 2012

TheHeez said:
Amen! I had this recently, the top layer was very soft and I took a full cut expecting a big splash out. Darn near hurt my wrist when I plowed into rock hard dirt. Getting your feet into that sands helps to determine what you are dealing with but the unexpected sure can mess it all up.

Absolutely. I used to not dig in that much but now it's the first thing I do!! Gives a solid idea of what you're about to hammer into.

rollin · Oct 1, 2012

HoselRocket104 said:
http://www.golfwolfcreek.com/layout9.asp?id=863&page=48676&sid=1896

Last March i was playing Wolf Creek in Mesquite NV. It's a pretty amazing golf course. Anyway we get to #4 and i'm only +1. See the layout of hole#4 on the link about. I hit my drive into one of the bunkers. When i stepped in i sunk about 6 inches. Never seen bunkers like this. I swung and hit it fat. The sand was so heavy. I ended up hitting six shots out of the sand. Each time was a herculian effort but it never went anywhere. I came out of the sand finally and was drenched with sweat and breathing hard. It was crazy. The rest of the day i was so scared of the bunkers. I thought they were all like that.

We got done and were having a beer in the clubhouse. The bartender asked what we thought and i brought up the bunkers on #4. He started laughing. They were repairing all the bunkers and had just finished laoding fresh sand into all of them. The water them constantly at night to get them ready. We were supposed to play them ground under repair but the started forgot to mention that and they didn't have signs. It didn't ruin my round because Wolf Creek is amazing. It did change my game though. I was a workout just to get out of the bunkers.

Thats preety funny lol. As I was reading the first paragraph the way you decsribed it I was thinking to myself it sounded like they must of been under repair. So early in the round must of took a toll on ya as you moved along espec if you were walking.

golfinFF · Oct 1, 2012

Inconsistent bunkers are not a huge deal as long as there are o rocks/pebbles in them. I do not like finding dirt under the sand be cause of terrible maintenace cause it hurt the wrists.

I absolutely refuse to play out of bunkers that have rocks in them!!!

ATLGolfer · Oct 1, 2012

I always hope for consistent sand, but I always test the sand with my feet in each bunker when I am getting set. I can usually get a good feel for how deep and dense the sand is when I dig my feet into the bunker in my stance. Is really a critical part of the shot that people sometimes take for granted. You are allowed to ground your feet, you might as well get some intel from them.

jrmy said:
How are you supposed to hit out of really hard sand, and I'm talking more than just a thick "crust" on top. One of the local courses around here has some sand that has grass springing out of it its so hard and I've always had problems trying to get out of it because its almost like I can just pick it clean off. If I try to splash it out I usually wind up with a chunk of sand taken out behind the ball.

For really packed sand, I play it like hard pan. I try to pinch the club right behind the ball with a short, compact swing. I also try to abbreviate my follow through, almost like a punch feel. If you do it correctly, you get a bunch of spin.

If there's not much of a lip in the bunker, you can also play the shot like a chip and just clip the ball off of the sand.

Dogman · Oct 1, 2012

rollin said:
never mind day to day, but much worse when it varry's hole to hole on same round if ya end up in a few

We have that a lot, especially this time of year. Very wet in the morning, maybe cement like, then they can get reall nice and fluffy, or not in the afternoon when it hits 85....it's such a guess. :confused2:

fairband · Oct 1, 2012

My home course has the " full of rocks" bunkers, I will try and pick them out and throw them in the woods whenever I am in there. Not to mention the sand is like being in a sandbox. You won't hear me say, "Get in the bunker!"

rollin · Oct 4, 2012

perhaps it just rained, wondering what you guys do when bunker is muddy or even a puddle? Now that i mention it, what is the ruling for that? is it now considered a hazard? is it loss of stroke? What?